Krigen mellom Israel og Hamas

[0laf]

Norway says UNRWA donor countries will soon restore funding

"A large number of those countries who suspended are [having] second thoughts," Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide said.

Oslo suggested on Wednesday that many of the 16 donor countries that temporarily cut off funding to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) will soon restore their financial contributions to the embattled agency.

“I think that a large number of those countries who suspended are [having] second thoughts,” Norwegian Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide told Reuters.


https://www.jns.org/norway-says-unrwa-donor-countries-will-soon-restore-funding/

[anomys]

Rhabagatz skrev (På 2.3.2024 den 1:40 PM):

Jeg registrerer at israeltrollene anser at det er en god ting at den organiserte utdelingen av mat og vann bryter sammen på Gaza i disse dager. Dette skjer samtidig som det kommer meldinger om barn som dør av underernæring.

Den humanitære krisen blir verre dag for dag, og nå er det Israel som har det direkte ansvaret (som okkupant) ettersom de har avskaffet det som fantes av myndigheter på Gaza. Jeg kan ikke forstå annet enn at dette svekker Israels sak i ICJ.

 

Israeltroll?!

[anomys]

anomys skrev (3 minutter siden):

Israeltroll?!

I et samfunn der det er en aksept for å hate jøder. 

Media og styresmakter gjør alt for ikke å gjøre noen anstøt mot islam.

Hamastroll, palestinatroll, det er det du er. 

[anomys]

0laf skrev (55 minutter siden):

Norway says UNRWA donor countries will soon restore funding

"A large number of those countries who suspended are [having] second thoughts," Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide said.

Oslo suggested on Wednesday that many of the 16 donor countries that temporarily cut off funding to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) will soon restore their financial contributions to the embattled agency.

“I think that a large number of those countries who suspended are [having] second thoughts,” Norwegian Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide told Reuters.


https://www.jns.org/norway-says-unrwa-donor-countries-will-soon-restore-funding/

Da settes  det inn nødhjelp til Hamas igjen

[Ørjanø]

Rhabagatz skrev (5 timer siden):

Hvis man for alvor mener at Hamas er en terrorgruppe (som er noe som omfattes av straffeloven), vil dets medlemmer ha krav på rettsikkerhetsgarantier og en rettferdig rettsak.

Hvis Hamas er (ulovlige?) stridende iht. folkeretten, vil deres overgrep klassifiseres som krigsforbrytelser og kan ha færre rettigheter.

Problemet er at man er så ivrig etter å stemple Hamas sine handlinger som terror (som om krigsforbrytelser ikke er ille nok) at man blander sammen juridiske begreper. Det er en ting at folk i et forum gjør det, men det er verre når myndighetene gjør det. 

 

Dette kan jeg ikke nok om. Men vil det da si at det kan være taktisk å ikke stemple Hamas som terrorgruppe? Da vil Hamas muligens ha færre rettigheter? 

Vet du om krigen mot Gaza vil stille seg anerledes hvis Hamas ikke hadde gått under som en terrororganisasjon? 

 

 

[Ørjanø]

0laf skrev (2 timer siden):

Norway says UNRWA donor countries will soon restore funding

"A large number of those countries who suspended are [having] second thoughts," Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide said.

Oslo suggested on Wednesday that many of the 16 donor countries that temporarily cut off funding to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) will soon restore their financial contributions to the embattled agency.

“I think that a large number of those countries who suspended are [having] second thoughts,” Norwegian Foreign Minister Espen Barth Eide told Reuters.


https://www.jns.org/norway-says-unrwa-donor-countries-will-soon-restore-funding/

Nei, de har visst fortsatt ikke verifisert påstandene til Israel om UNRWA! 

"Barth Eide indicated that many countries will likely restore funding to UNRWA after the investigations are completed.

But then, of course, they need an honorable way out, which means they are hoping, I think—without speaking for individual countries—that they will get something from these investigations that suggest that they can say: “Well, we needed to suspend, but now we’re back.'”

Fra linken din. 

 

[0laf]

 

[PrettyBoy]

David Ben-Guirion told Nahum Goldmann, president of the World Jewish in 1956, “If I was an Arab leader, I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country. Sure, God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? Our God is not theirs. We come from Israel, it’s true, but that was two thousand years ago, and what is that to them? There has been anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their faullt? They only see one thing: we have come here and stolen their country. Why should they accept that?” (Nahum Goldmann, ‘The Jewish Paradox’, New York, Grosset & Dunlap1978)

David Ben-Gurion, opprinnelig David Grüen, ble i 1948 den første statsminister i staten Israel.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Ben-Gurion

 

 

[0laf]

 

PrettyBoy skrev (14 minutter siden):

David Ben-Guirion told Nahum Goldmann, president of the World Jewish in 1956...

Nahum Goldmann var ingen stor fan av Ben-Gurion, men kom med dette sitatet i 1978, hele 22 år etter at det angeivelig ble sagt i en helt vanlig privat samtale, og beleilig nok flere år etter at Ben-Gurion hadde gått bort.

Ben-Gurion sa mange ting, både om fred med araberne, tvangsflytting av araberne, krig med araberne, og en hel haug annet, men det meste av det han sa er nedskrevet fra offisielle møter, taler og annet.

Goldmanns fantastiske hukommelse, hvor han husket en lengre (for det er mer en det du siterer) samtale med Ben-Gurion flere tiår senere, og først valgte å komme med det etter at Ben-Gurion var død og begravet, har gjort at dette sitatet generelt sett ikke tillegges noen vekt, da det er umulig å bekrefte, selv om det på ingen måte er umulig at Ben-Gurion kunne sagt noe slikt.

Det er forøvrig ikke særlig relevant hva Ben-Gurion sa for 70 år siden heller.

[Ørjanø]

anomys skrev (4 timer siden):

Da settes  det inn nødhjelp til Hamas igjen

Hovedsakelig er det sivile som får nødhjelp. 

[0laf]

Ørjanø skrev (15 minutter siden):

Hovedsakelig er det sivile som får nødhjelp. 

Javisst, tipper det er særlig journalister og lærere som mottar mye av nødhjelpen.

[Snikpellik]

I natt holdt Joe Biden sin State of the Union-tale. En tale som har fått meget god omtale både i pressen og fra en del republikanere, ikke minst en del oppmerksomhet for hva som skjedde like etterpå da Biden sendte en ordentlig fin grimase i retning en av de mest koko politikerne universet har sett - Marjorie Taylor Greene, som hadde kledd seg ut som MAGA-kultist for anledningen og satt og ropte under talen:

Spoiler

 

Uansett, i talen snakket Biden en del om krigen mellom Israel og Hamas. I talen kom han selvsagt med de daglige utsagnene, som at Hamas må slippe gislene, at Israel har rett til å gå krige mot dem, og om traumet etter terrorangrepet 7. oktober. Han fikk stående applaus fra begge kamre da han snakket om familiene til gislene som fremdeles holdes fanget. Noen av dem var i salen. Han snakket også om å holde trusselen fra Iran i sjakk, og om innsatsen mot terroren fra Houthiene.

Men han sa også en del ting han ikke har sagt før, og det er som alltid det nye som er mest interessant. Det var veldig mye fokus på de sivile lidelsene i talen. Her er noen av sitatene:

Sitat

“To the leadership of Israel, I say this: humanitarian assistance cannot be a secondary consideration or a bargaining chip. Protecting and saving innocent lives has to be a priority,” Biden said, as Washington continued to stiffen its tone with Israel while maintaining its overall support for the Jewish state.

Sitat

“This war has taken a greater toll on innocent civilians than all previous wars in Gaza combined. More than 30,000 Palestinians have been killed. Most of whom are not Hamas,” he lamented.

Sitat

“Thousands and thousands are innocent women and children. Girls and boys also orphaned. Nearly 2 million more Palestinians under bombardment or displaced. Homes destroyed, neighborhoods in rubble, cities in ruin. Families without food, water, medicine. It’s heartbreaking.”

Biden bekreftet også i talen amerikanernes planer om å bygge en midlertidig nødhjelpshavn for å frakte nødhjelp direkte fra Middelhavet og inn til Gaza. Den skal bygges i samarbeid med "likesinnede land og humanitære organisasjoner". Israel sier de støtter dette. Han sa at dette ikke ville kreve noen amerikanske soldater på bakken på Gazastripen. Videre sa han at Israel også må tillate mer nødhjelp inn til Gaza.

Sitat

“This temporary pier would enable a massive increase in the amount of humanitarian assistance getting into Gaza every day,” he said. “But Israel must also do its part. Israel must allow more aid into Gaza and ensure that humanitarian workers aren’t caught in the crossfire”

Om tostatsløsningen sa Biden at det er den eneste veien til å sikre sikkerhet og demokrati for Israel og fred og verdighet for palestinerne, kanskje det aller tydeligste han har vært på dette til nå og som garantert vil irritere Netanyahu:

Sitat

“The only real solution is a two-state solution. I say this as a lifelong supporter of Israel and the only American president to visit Israel in wartime”

“There is no other path that guarantees Israel’s security and democracy. There is no other path that guarantees Palestinians can live with peace and dignity. There is no other path that guarantees peace between Israel and all of its Arab neighbors, including Saudi Arabia”

https://www.timesofisrael.com/biden-in-sotu-pledges-to-free-hostages-warns-israel-against-using-aid-as-bargaining-chip/

I andre israelske medier fokuseres det også mest på at Biden var "streng" med Israel om nødhjelp:

Biden sends firm message to Jerusalem on Gaza aid in State of the Union address
https://www.jpost.com/american-politics/article-790931

Biden announced on a naval dock: "I say to the leaders of Israel - aid cannot be a bargaining chip"
https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/byrovrwp6#autoplay

Endret 8. mars av Snikpellik

[Ørjanø]

Snikpellik skrev (11 minutter siden):

I natt holdt Joe Biden sin State of the Union-tale. En tale som har fått meget god omtale både i pressen og fra en del republikanere, ikke minst en del oppmerksomhet for hva som skjedde like etterpå da Biden sendte en ordentlig fin grimase i retning en av de mest koko politikerne universet har sett - Marjorie Taylor Greene, som hadde kledd seg ut som MAGA-kultist for anledningen:

  Vis skjult innhold

 

Uansett, i talen snakket Biden en del om krigen mellom Israel og Hamas. I talen kom han selvsagt med de daglige utsagnene, som at Hamas må slippe gislene, at Israel har rett til å gå krige mot dem, og om traumet etter terrorangrepet 7. oktober. Han fikk stående applaus fra begge kamre da han snakket om familiene til gislene som fremdeles holdes fanget. Han snakket også om å holde trusselen fra Iran i sjakk, og om innsatsen mot terroren fra Houthiene.

Men han sa også en del ting han ikke har sagt før, og det er som alltid det nye som er mest interessant. Det var veldig mye fokus på de sivile lidelsene i talen. Her er noen av sitatene:

Biden bekreftet også i talen amerikanernes planer om å bygge en midlertidig nødhjelpshavn for å frakte nødhjelp direkte fra Middelhavet og inn til Gaza. Israel sier de støtter dette. Han sa at dette ikke ville kreve noen amerikanske soldater på bakken på Gazastripen. Videre sa han at Israel også må tillate mer nødhjelp inn til Gaza.

Om tostatsløsningen sa Biden at det er den eneste veien til å sikre sikkerhet og demokrati for Israel og fred og verdighet for palestinerne, kanskje det aller tydeligste han har vært på dette til nå og som garantert vil irritere Netanyahu:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/biden-in-sotu-pledges-to-free-hostages-warns-israel-against-using-aid-as-bargaining-chip/

Bra tale. Fint å se de legger press på Israel, samtidig støtter dem i å ta Hamas. 

Men hva om krigen dras ut, og Trump blir president om litt under et år? Da endres vel ting relativt raskt med tanke på sivile, tostatsløsning, støtte til BN etc? Noen som vet? 

 

[Snikpellik]

Tyskland donerer 20 nye millioner til nødhjelp på Gazastripen. Totalt har Tyskland dermed donert 165 millioner euro etter 7. oktober.

Sitat

We are increasing our humanitarian assistance for Gaza by an additional 20 million euro. Yet that is by far not enough. The number of lorries transporting life-saving food aid, medicine and other supplies to Gaza has sharply decreased in recent weeks. This is unacceptable.

Sitat

The Israeli Government must immediately enable secure and unhindered access for humanitarian assistance. The International Court of Justice, too, has ordered it to do so. Following the breakdown of public order in many parts of the Gaza Strip, the Israeli army must ensure that humanitarian assistance can be successfully distributed.

Humanitarian disaster in Gaza – Germany has increased its humanitarian assistance
https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/en/aussenpolitik/-/2627918

[Rhabagatz]

4 hours ago, Snikpellik said:

Tyskland donerer 20 nye millioner til nødhjelp på Gazastripen. Totalt har Tyskland dermed donert 165 millioner euro etter 7. oktober.

Humanitarian disaster in Gaza – Germany has increased its humanitarian assistance
https://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/en/aussenpolitik/-/2627918

Dette vil skje i samarbeid med FN....

[0laf]

How the Gaza Ministry of Health Fakes Casualty Numbers

The number of civilian casualties in Gaza has been at the center of international attention since the start of the war. The main source for the data has been the Hamas-controlled Gaza Health Ministry, which now claims more than 30,000 dead, the majority of which it says are children and women. Recently, the Biden administration lent legitimacy to Hamas’ figure. When asked at a House Armed Services Committee hearing last week how many Palestinian women and children have been killed since Oct. 7, Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin said the number was “over 25,000.” The Pentagon quickly clarified that the secretary “was citing an estimate from the Hamas-controlled Health Ministry.” President Biden himself had earlier cited this figure, asserting that “too many, too many of the over 27,000 Palestinians killed in this conflict have been innocent civilians and children, including thousands of children.” The White House also explained that the president “was referring to publicly available data about the total number of casualties.”

Here’s the problem with this data: The numbers are not real. That much is obvious to anyone who understands how naturally occurring numbers work. The casualties are not overwhelmingly women and children, and the majority may be Hamas fighters.

If Hamas’ numbers are faked or fraudulent in some way, there may be evidence in the numbers themselves that can demonstrate it. While there is not much data available, there is a little, and it is enough: From Oct. 26 until Nov. 10, 2023, the Gaza Health Ministry released daily casualty figures that include both a total number and a specific number of women and children.

The first place to look is the reported “total” number of deaths. The graph of total deaths by date is increasing with almost metronomical linearity, as the graph in Figure 1 reveals.

The graph reveals an extremely regular increase in casualties over the period. Data aggregated by the author and provided by the United Nations Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA), based on Gaza MoH figures.

 

This regularity is almost surely not real. One would expect quite a bit of variation day to day. In fact, the daily reported casualty count over this period averages 270 plus or minus about 15%. This is strikingly little variation. There should be days with twice the average or more and others with half or less. Perhaps what is happening is the Gaza ministry is releasing fake daily numbers that vary too little because they do not have a clear understanding of the behavior of naturally occurring numbers. Unfortunately, verified control data is not available to formally test this conclusion, but the details of the daily counts render the numbers suspicious.

Similarly, we should see variation in the number of child casualties that tracks the variation in the number of women. This is because the daily variation in death counts is caused by the variation in the number of strikes on residential buildings and tunnels which should result in considerable variability in the totals but less variation in the percentage of deaths across groups. This is a basic statistical fact about chance variability. Consequently, on the days with many women casualties there should be large numbers of children casualties, and on the days when just a few women are reported to have been killed, just a few children should be reported. This relationship can be measured and quantified by the R-square (R2 ) statistic that measures how correlated the daily casualty count for women is with the daily casualty count for children. If the numbers were real, we would expect R2 to be substantively larger than 0, tending closer to 1.0. But R2 is .017 which is statistically and substantively not different from 0.

The daily number of children reported to have been killed is totally unrelated to the number of women reported. The R2 is .017 and the relationship is statistically and substantively insignificant.

This lack of correlation is the second circumstantial piece of evidence suggesting the numbers are not real. But there is more. The daily number of women casualties should be highly correlated with the number of non-women and non-children (i.e., men) reported. Again, this is expected because of the nature of battle. The ebbs and flows of the bombings and attacks by Israel should cause the daily count to move together. But that is not what the data show. Not only is there not a positive correlation, there is a strong negative correlation, which makes no sense at all and establishes the third piece of evidence that the numbers are not real.

The correlation between the daily men and daily women death count is absurdly strong and negative (p-value < .0001).

 

Consider some further anomalies in the data: First, the death count reported on Oct. 29 contradicts the numbers reported on the 28th, insofar as they imply that 26 men came back to life. This can happen because of misattribution or just reporting error. There are a few other days where the numbers of men are reported to be near 0. If these were just reporting errors, then on those days where the death count for men appears to be in error, the women’s count should be typical, at least on average. But it turns out that on the three days when the men’s count is near zero, suggesting an error, the women’s count is high. In fact, the three highest daily women casualty count occurs on those three days.



There are three days where the male casualty count is close to 0. These three days correspond to the three highest daily women’s casualty count.

Taken together, what does this all imply? While the evidence is not dispositive, it is highly suggestive that a process unconnected or loosely connected to reality was used to report the numbers. Most likely, the Hamas ministry settled on a daily total arbitrarily. We know this because the daily totals increase too consistently to be real. Then they assigned about 70% of the total to be women and children, splitting that amount randomly from day to day. Then they in-filled the number of men as set by the predetermined total. This explains all the data observed.

There are other obvious red flags. The Gaza Health Ministry has consistently claimed that about 70% of the casualties are women or children. This total is far higher than the numbers reported in earlier conflicts with Israel. Another red flag, raised by Salo Aizenberg and written about extensively, is that if 70% of the casualties are women and children and 25% of the population is adult male, then either Israel is not successfully eliminating Hamas fighters or adult male casualty counts are extremely low. This by itself strongly suggests that the numbers are at a minimum grossly inaccurate and quite probably outright faked. Finally, on Feb. 15, Hamas admitted to losing 6,000 of its fighters, which represents more than 20% of the total number of casualties reported.

Taken together, Hamas is reporting not only that 70% of casualties are women and children but also that 20% are fighters. This is not possible unless Israel is somehow not killing noncombatant men, or else Hamas is claiming that almost all the men in Gaza are Hamas fighters.

Are there better numbers? Some objective commentators have acknowledged Hamas’ numbers in previous battles with Israel to be roughly accurate. Nevertheless, this war is wholly unlike its predecessors in scale or scope; international observers who were able to monitor previous wars are now completely absent, so the past can’t be assumed to be a reliable guide. The fog of war is especially thick in Gaza, making it impossible to quickly determine civilian death totals with any accuracy. Not only do official Palestinian death counts fail to differentiate soldiers from children, but Hamas also blames all deaths on Israel even if caused by Hamas’ own misfired rockets, accidental explosions, deliberate killings, or internal battles. One group of researchers at the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health compared Hamas reports to data on UNRWA workers. They argued that because the death rates were approximately similar, Hamas’ numbers must not be inflated. But their argument relied on a crucial and unverified assumption: that UNRWA workers are not disproportionately more likely to be killed than the general population. That premise exploded when it was uncovered that a sizable fraction of UNRWA workers are affiliated with Hamas. Some were even exposed as having participated in the Oct. 7 massacre itself.

The truth can’t yet be known and probably never will be. The total civilian casualty count is likely to be extremely overstated. Israel estimates that at least 12,000 fighters have been killed. If that number proves to be even reasonably accurate, then the ratio of noncombatant casualties to combatants is remarkably low: at most 1.4 to 1 and perhaps as low as 1 to 1. By historical standards of urban warfare, where combatants are embedded above and below into civilian population centers, this is a remarkable and successful effort to prevent unnecessary loss of life while fighting an implacable enemy that protects itself with civilians.

Abraham Wyner - Professor of Statistics and Data Science at The Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania and Faculty Co-Director of the Wharton Sports Analytics and Business Initiative.

 

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/how-gaza-health-ministry-fakes-casualty-numbers

[0laf]

US, UK, France request emergency UN Security Council meeting on Hamas sexual violence

The meeting being requested is to examine the crimes that emerged from the UN report on Hamas's sexual violence on October 7 and the hostage situation in Gaza.
 

At the request of Israeli Foreign Minister Israel Katz, the United States, the United Kingdom, and France submitted on Friday morning an official request to conduct a UN Security Council emergency meeting.

The meeting being requested is to examine the crimes that emerged from the UN report on Hamas's sexual violence on October 7 and the hostage situation in Gaza.

In a statement, Katz thanked supporting nations for their calls to convene an emergency meeting to discuss the findings of the UN report on sexual violence perpetrated by Hamas.

Katz also accused UN Secretary-General António Guterres of continually turning a blind eye to the atrocities of October 7, including the sexual violence. 

"With every passing moment, the hostages continue to be injured, and the UN Secretary-General continues to close his eyes and cover his ears as if nothing happened. Precisely on International Women's Day, his continued silence is a disgrace and casts a stain on his head that will not be erased."

https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-790941

___________

Kanskje FN endelig klarer å designere Hamas som terrorister, men det er vel mer trolig at Russland nedlegger veto på vegne av Iran og andre terrorstater som støtter Hamas.

[0laf]

 

[Gjest Gjest slettet-ld9eg7s96q]

Boomer-Willy er ute og tråkker i salaten igjen:

Sitat

Den tidligere justisministeren leder nå Stortingets justiskomité. Amundsen har slettet flere innlegg, men nekter å beklage.

Torsdag kveld uttrykte han sin støtte til Israel i et Facebook-innlegg, som førte til høy temperatur i kommentarfeltet.

I et av svarinnleggene skriver Amundsen:

«Islamister som ytrer seg her kan reise til helvete. Jeg vil gjøre alt jeg kan for å sende dere hjem til deres hjemland. Dersom du ytrer deg med antisemittiske holdninger her frem til 2025 kan vi rydde opp. La oss telle dere opp ... Og sende dere ut.»

Han svarer bekreftende i et nytt innlegg når han blir spurt om han fører en liste.

 

Endret 8. mars av Gjest slettet-ld9eg7s96q

[bshagen]

Utrolig uprofesjonelt, og nok en gang så kan man se grunnen til at ingen kan ta FrP seriøst som et parti, de har for mange sånne som en gang blant greier å rote det til. Én ting er Listhaug (som antagelig er enig med fyren) som må rydde opp, men en annen ting er de andre partiene som antagelig må samarbeide med de ved neste valg

Endret 8. mars av bshagen