Too difficult to find a job as an architect foreigner in Norway?

[george85]

Hei. I was wondering if someone can give me a tip about what am I doing wrong, when it comes to finding an architect job position in Norway.

 

I have been sending a job vacant position offers for an architect, to Norwegian companies, well almost for last 10 months. And nothing, zip, nodda. I am constantly getting negative replies.

 

I am the first one that got a degree on my faculty, among 110 students in whole generation. I have around 12 months of working experience, out of which 2 at architectural company in Rotterdam (it was suppose to be 3 months, bud I had bad timing, their summer holidays started). I got a written official recognition of my degree from Nokut (Norwegian agency for recognition of foreign higher education), and it has been recognized as Master's degree (300 points, 5 years of studies). Besides regular architectural stuff, I also do some things that not many architects know how to do: light calculation (illuminance) structural analysis and design of construction (particulary masonry wall systems with its slabs, beams and foundations), and plumbing installations in buildings. Furthermore I have pretty good written references from my ex professors, my ex dean, boss from the Rotterdam...

Also I am ready to accept that minor (I believe it is 3 months?) contract, so that my potential principal will not be concerned about difficulties of getting me fired, if I do not suit his expectations. Not to mention that I have no intention of negotiating about the salary amount. Whatever they offer it will be enough.

 

 

 

Now, I am sure the problem is not within the technical stuff related to the way I write my CV, Portfolio or Cover letter (although I find this topic very helpful).

 

But there are some things that I am aware of: my biggest minuses are:

 

- I do not speak Norwegian. I started learning it, but it will probably take me years to gain an average speaking ability. The nearest Norwegian language school is 500km distanced from my place. I bought a dictionary, "Ny i Norge" book and audio cd, but still it's going pretty tough.

But this was not a problem on my internship in The Netherlands. Most of architects in the office were foreigners, not Dutch, so I guess the situation can be somewhat similar in Norway? Or am I wrong? I understand that I need language in every part of life, not only at my working place. But still why can't I use English, a year or two, until I learn Norwegian.

 

- My country (Serbia) is not a member of EU nor Shengen zone. This means my employee needs to do some paper work in order to provide me a work permit. I guess it is much easier for him to take Norwegian, Dane, or Polish architect, which already have a valid right to work.

 

- Address in my CV, and telephone number are Serbian. From the employees point of view, this automatically disqualifies me. I will try to put a Norwegian address and phone number (from a more of an acquaintance than friend of mine) into my CV. But again this is also very bad, as the potential employers will not get me on the phone, but him (my acquaintance) and even if they are still interested in me, and contact me on my Serbian number, I still need some time to fly over to Norway, which leads us to the following problem:

 

- Lack of funds. Prices of a room rent in Oslo are amazingly high. But what bothers me more, is that most of people are not willing to rent you any kind of room within 3 months period, or even if they are, then they ask for some kind of ID number (which I get from my employer), which I do not own, as I came only on an interview. Not to mention advance payment for room rent.

Also it is too expensive for me to call by telephone any company in Norway; this would be a great plus, if I could do that, as employers appreciate when ever a potential employee calls and informs himself about the position, advertisement dead line...

 

- I know that there was and partly still is an economical crisis going on in the world, but at least from the perspective of architecture and construction sector, it is going pretty well, at least in Oslo, despite the economical crisis. Or am I wrong?

 

 

 

In the end, despite all these minuses, I think I deserve some kind of chance. But it seems this is all going to end by moving not north, but east - leaving to UAE. Sadly, Norwegian Snøhetta and its projects had crucial influence on my decision to became an architect. My dream was to became part of their team one day, or at least to work in their home country.

 

If some cognate soul wishes to take a look at my Portfolio, here it is

 

 

 

Tusen takk for all the replies, and help on this fairytale story.

Endret 29. desember 2010 av george85

[lolmaster_flash]

First advice: move to Norway. How would anyone hire you if you live in Serbia? I wouldn´t.

[Camlon]

You can't just get a job anywhere just because you got a degree.

1. You don't have a Norwegian citizenship

2. You are not able to speak Norwegian

3. You have no contacts in Norway and it's quite common to get jobs through contacts in Norway.

4. Norwegians don't trust Serbian education, you don't have enough work experience or international experience.

 

Why would anyone hire you? Yes, it's easier to get a job in Norway, but that doesn't mean they will hire anyone. You have absolutly no chance of getting a job in Norway yet! If you want a job in Norway, then

 

1. Learn to speak Norwegian fluently

2. Get more work experience in western countries

3. Take some education in Norway, so you will get some contacts.

 

Then you might have a chance to get a job in Norway, but it's still hard because there is no straight forward way to get citizenship in Norway. However, you can come to New Zealand. New Zealand needs architects (not now, but in a few years) and is easy to immigrate to if you have skills.

[Yavel]

In my experience architect in Norway, are a closed circle of friends.

[Blåbær]

This article is from august. It states that the unemplyment among architects in Norway is double compared to the general unemployment. Im guessing if I would hire a new architect I would choose a norwegian who know Norwegian building style, history, language and so on.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/okonomi/1.7244126

[george85]

Thank you for all the answers.

 

Mr. Camlon, I can see you are a Kiwi. Sorry if I offended your south island's nature, by ranking it number 2, below Norway. But, hey you still have that norhern island of yours. They say it is a true paradise.

 

New Zealand may need architects, but still you have an imperial measuring system. This will be quite hard for me, as all the standards that I learned during studies were in metric system.

 

 

 

Takk for alle svar, og Godt Nytt År.

[vivastar]

Dont move to Norway, its expensive and cold here

[george85]

so I was told.

Hm, few months ago, a dutch friend of mine told this to one italian: "do not move to the netherlands the weather is shitty, we have a plenty of rain". But then the other dutch guy said: "do not worry about the rain, on the rain you grow"

 

I can say something similar on this:

"on the cold, you grow"

 

And about the expensiveness: well, your government probably did not do it on purposely. Higher prices keep the inflation out of the business. Higher taxes are due to free medical care and education.

 

I am not concerned about the expensiveness, as I do not intend to own a Ferrari or live in some of those Crabs villa's.

[Reg2000]

Someone already said it but i'll repeat it.

If you want to get a job here you need to live here. If there had been a great lack of architects or if you had an impressive CV with lots of working experience maybe the employer would look past that.

 

I dont think the language is that important, but yes not speaking the language also holds you back.

[george85]

thank you for an advice Reg.

[aurstad]

First of, don't listen to people here telling you'll never find a job in Norway.

 

Second, if the price of calling is too great - Try out Skype, or other VOIP providers. It's great and cheap for calling cross borders. It'll give you a normal phonenumber that people can reach you on.

 

Thirdly, I couldn't figure out from your post if you have been in Norway before? I'd suggest you take some time to plan a visit to Norway, if not only for a week. Take time to research the companies you'd want to work for. If possible, try to schedule an appointment with them to a give them your CV and a quick chat with their HR-department. If you plan it right, it doesn't have to be so expensive. Use sites like Couchsurfer and you'll save lots.

 

Oh, and don't tell them you'll work for anything they'll offer

 

If you need any more help, post here or just PM me!

[george85]

Well thank you on such a nice and helpful reply Aurstad!

 

Hm, about skype: Inspired with your reply, I read something about their low prices, and I will probably order some of those. But I am still confused about that number you are talking about: I though that I get only a skype "username or account", not a phone number? Or am I wrong?

 

About "telling them you will work for anything they'll offer":

I thougth that Norway work regulations, have some kind of protection against exploitation of workers, when it comes to the values of the wages? For example, an architect can not get a salary lower than xxxx value. And that xxxx minimum is quite enough to cover all the humble and normal expenses and charges, of a single living person, right? So from a perspective of my inability to speak Norwegian, lack of valid Shengen papers, and over iron curtain wall education and experience - offering them this minimum xxxx value, will give me even at least some kind of chance of getting my future employer interested in an interview, if not getting a job? Or am I wrong about this too?

[Prusk]

Well, Norway don't really have a minimum wage policy, so an employer could actually pay you what he desires, as long as you have signed the contract.

 

In the other hand, no architect office with respect for them self would pay an employee so little money that they would struggle in the Norwegian society.

The minimum wage you've been hearing about is against "price dumping" in the constructing business. I'm actually not sure if the campaign against price dumping is to help the foreigners being abused for a very low salary seen from a Norwegian point of view, or if it is to ensure that Norwegian in the same business still have a job.

 

Anyway, speaking Norwegian is almost a must in Norway. Unless you have an impressive CV, I don't see how you would get a job as an architect in Norway.

 

You might want to be more specific to what you really search. Do you design buildings? Do you design landscape? Do you design furniture? This should, of course be part, of your CV, but if you're newly educated, you would want to get experience into one specific subject that might be considered valuable by a potential employer.

 

Also the architectural society in Norway seem to be a bit like a "closed circle". You better know someone to get in. That or have some amazing results to show for.

 

With no Schengen papers, I guess you have small chances of getting in like a freshmen in Norway. We educate loads of architects here, and it seems like many of the Norwegians educated here also have trouble finding jobs. I cannot say that I think it would be any easier for you.

 

If you had 5-10 years of experience, then your chances would be far greater. That's my guess, at least.

[thomassit0]

The architect industry was hit pretty hard by the finance crisis, i read that a lot lost their job, so i don't think it'll be easy to get a job now. Sorry for raining on your parade. And if companies are hiring, they'll probably choose someone who lives here & speak norwegian and so on over you.

Endret 6. januar 2011 av Thomas_H

[aurstad]

The company I work for, although in a completely different field, has hired several English-only speaking engineers, some from other East-European countries like Romania. This in the last 6 months. This only to be said that stating that you can't get a job in Norway without knowing Norwegian is not true.

 

But the point still stands - the faster you learn Norwegian - the better. Also if your only way of communicating is English, it should be darn good!

 

 

About Skype, they have a thing called Online Numbers. It's a normal (to everybody else) phone number that you call and the call is routed to the pc where you have Skype installed. Skype also gives you acces to Voicemail so if you're unavailable they can leave a message. It seems like having a Online Number though costs extra.

 

Read more here.

 

But the thing is, just use Skype to call the companies you are interested in. In you CV, leave your cellphone number or something. Hey, if they call you back it's in your best interest to catch that call and rather pay the somewhat higher phone bill later - right?

 

 

I've found a few sites that might help you more.

 

http://www.hio.no/Karrieresenteret/Looking-for-work-in-Norway/Working-in-Norway

 

http://mylittlenorway.com/2009/10/how-to-get-a-job-in-norway/

 

http://www.ntnu.edu/aboutntnu/norwegian-taxes

 

http://mylittlenorway.com/2010/04/do-you-really-want-to-live-in-norway/

 

 

Maybe you already have read these, if not - enjoy

Endret 6. januar 2011 av aurstad

[PerB]

And your English is far from perfect. If your job application suffers from the same kind of grammatical errors it might be difficult to obtain a job in a foreign country.

[george85]

Thank you for all the answers, advices and help.

 

@Aurstad: those foreign non-Norwegian speaking workers you are talking about: were probably hired in oil or IT industry?

[aurstad]

Thank you for all the answers, advices and help.

 

@Aurstad: those foreign non-Norwegian speaking workers you are talking about: were probably hired in oil or IT industry?

 

They were engineers hired in the Solar energy field.

[Camlon]

Thank you for all the answers, advices and help.

 

@Aurstad: those foreign non-Norwegian speaking workers you are talking about: were probably hired in oil or IT industry?

 

They were engineers hired in the Solar energy field.

You know that something different. It's much easier getting an engineering job than an architect job and Norwegian is less important. The fact is, he has applied for lots of jobs and no one gave him an answer. Yes, he won't get an architect job if he can't speak Norwegian.

[aurstad]

Thank you for all the answers, advices and help.

 

@Aurstad: those foreign non-Norwegian speaking workers you are talking about: were probably hired in oil or IT industry?

 

They were engineers hired in the Solar energy field.

You know that something different. It's much easier getting an engineering job than an architect job and Norwegian is less important. The fact is, he has applied for lots of jobs and no one gave him an answer. Yes, he won't get an architect job if he can't speak Norwegian.

 

 

I disagree. Sure there probably are more engineering jobs than architect jobs, so the competition is tougher, I'm not denying that. And surely, knowing Norwegian would only help his chances. But to think that there is no way that any company would ever hire him? I'm sure if he puts his mind to it, its possible.